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The Smoking Apples MacBook Pro Review | Smoking Apples

November 10, 2008 at 3:51 pm

Apple discontinues the 23″ Apple Cinema Display | Smoking Apples

November 13, 2008 at 4:24 am

Ashwin November 4, 2008 at 4:36 pm ashwinr.com

All my laptops has been glossy and I love it that way. If you’re a designer or watch a lot of videos, then glossy is a good choice. The only issue is the smudging and needs cleaning almost every day.

   

James November 4, 2008 at 10:09 pm

I just replaced my Feb 2006 MacBook Pro with an aluminum MacBook. So I went from Firewire 400 and a Matte screen to no FW and glossy and I don’t have any complaints. I haven’t used Firewire in over a year (the writing was on the wall so no new FW drives) and I just love the glossy display. It looks significantly better than the matte display on the old MacBook Pro albeit with less of a range in the viewing angles.

The constant whining is tedious but it is typical of the blog-echo-chamber.

   

Brad November 4, 2008 at 10:36 pm

I plan on getting a new Macbook and I’ll just get the matte protector. And, for the record, I’ve owned both a glossy Macbook Pro and a matter, and I definitely prefer the matte screen.

   

Jai November 4, 2008 at 10:48 pm

I am a photographer by profession and was very disappointed to learn that Apple has made available the new MacBook Pro laptops and Cinema Displays only with glossy screens and no options for a matte screen !!

For a Photographer, this type of screen poses several problems :

1. Glossy screens tend to provide a more saturated range of colors - This will make calibrating the monitors to “simulate” what the image will look like on paper very difficult if not impossible.

2. Not only do the screens provide highly saturated colors, but also provide for high contrast images - This makes for very difficult setting of highlight and shadow detail, a very critical aspect in working with images !

3. The glossy screens are highly reflective - Working a whole day in front of a monitor that reflects will cause a lot of eye strain and become an annoyance.

I have already written to Apple ( like many others ) requesting them to reconsider, but feel that Apple will not provide an option for a matte screen.

Any thoughts or solutions ( besides Photodon;s Film as it seems this film makes the images/screen look grainy - solves one issue to reveal another ) that can be provided to the thousands of photographers, graphic artists and videographers who would find a reliable solution absolutely valuable ?

Jai

   

crbc November 5, 2008 at 4:19 am

You say that you did “a survey, asking only those who have actually purchased either of the new notebooks which display they preferred”. And then you state “Surprisingly, most of the users I spoke to are not worried about the glossy screens.”

How can you be surprised??? You didn’t, or weren’t able to survey any of the people who DIDN’T purchase one! OBVIOUSLY, you’d have to pretty stupid to purchase an expensive laptop without liking the screen before you purchased one! And OBVIOUSLY, if you ask only those who purchased a glossy screen they are going to say they prefer a glossy screen. Duh!

So survey ME! I’ve purchased a new top-of-the line PowerBook or MacBook Pro every new edition model since 1992. I used a new MacBook Pro for an entire day trying to like it. I simply could not deal with the distracting reflections in the glossy screen. Too much eye fatigue. Maybe its OK for those who look at pictures and movies. I use mine to do real work for usually 6 or more hours a day. Life is too short to have a tool that fatigues. So add me to what you refer to as a “whiner”.

Chris

   

Milind Alvares November 5, 2008 at 12:02 pm goobimama.blogspot.com

The title and intro explicitely say, this is only about the new MacBook users. So how can we be wrong about not asking those who didn’t purchase one? We just want to know if the glossy screen is only a shiny thing that attracts customers who later regret it. Apparently, it is not.

I posed a perfectly valid question on our twitter feed, “new MacBook users, is the glossy screen affecting you or not?”. And that’s the only negative answer that came back. The other negative one I found on a forum. Like I said, there are negative comments all over the place, but I could not confirm them (that is, write back and get a response as to whether he/she is a new MacBook owner). And we had a lot more positive responses on our twitter feed.

That said, thank you for letting us know your side of the story. The comments will stay here and will be part of the survey. Who knows, if we get enough of negative comments we could even change the title!

   

Louie November 5, 2008 at 1:44 pm

I have only checked the new MacBook Pro at the store and I can say I don’t mind the glare. I own a 15” matte MacBook pro and my display looks pale in comparison. Of course, the situation seems to be split 50-50, with many users finding the glare unbearable, and the rest not affected by it at all. I guess that’s why there was a matte or glossy option. I hope Apple does something about this at least for the MacBook Pro to give the pro users a matte option. Personally, I’d go with the glossy one.

   

Liam November 5, 2008 at 7:52 pm

I have always been a matte aficionado, and chose the matte display over the glossy one when I got my MacBook Pro. But there’s something different about the new one. I haven’t dumped my matte MacBook Pro, but given the choice I would definitely choose this one over a matte display. It’s not like the previous glossy displays. The brightness and colour of the new one really make up for that little bit of glare you get at certain angles. And the display is really sharp. Viewing or even working with Aperture is simply amazing. GlossBook +1.

   

Vids November 6, 2008 at 1:14 am

I love the glossy display on the new MacBook. The display looks so stunning. The black border around just adds to the whole jazz. ‘Glassy’ over matte anyday.

   

Boiling Piont November 6, 2008 at 4:17 am

While the subject heading suggests the question is aimed at ‘MacBook’ users, what’s interesting here is this gloss trend creeping into my area of work - the new 24” display included.

As a Pro user I agree with Jais comments above when it comes to practicality in the creative industry. I’d really like to know what Apple was - or if they were – thinking about. Obviously not Pro users, who continue to be a large part of their core business.

I’m also amazed at people’s comments regarding these displays. Comments like ‘you just get used to it’, ‘all you need to do is sit in a certain position…’ or ‘if you can see past the glare, they’re wonderful.’ Are you kidding? It’s almost as if users are making excuses for their purchase. If you’re someone who enjoys the richer viewing experience of gloss, that’s fine. It looks nice. Practically, if you’re someone who sits in front of a display for many hours doing colour critical work, the gloss only option is frankly distracting and impractical. Our iMac 24” is testament to that. The obvious solution would have been to continue to offer a choice of the two. Apple can certainly afford it, but that’d make too much sense.

   

Milind Alvares November 6, 2008 at 11:49 am goobimama.blogspot.com

Well actually we included MacBook and Pro users in the review.

I agree with you on the 24” cinema display. I mean, it’s cool if they just introduce the 24” display as an extra for ‘regular’ users, and keep the rest of the ACD line-up as matte, but I don’t see that happening. By Jan we will definitely be seeing the other monitors go glossy as well, and that’s gonna suck.

   

Boiling Point November 7, 2008 at 1:51 am

Personally I think the new 24” is an odd product in terms of market appeal. It’d be very disappointed if the whole display line went gloss and that was it. I’d like to think Apple would use some common sense and understand that gloss, while sexier than matte, just doesnt benefit everyone’s productivity. Still, it’s Apple we’re talking about, and once the mould is made, that’s it.

So, I guess we could stock pile a few current 23” displays and (gasp!) - the Dell 2480 24” puts up a nice picture. Be tragic to go that way.

btw, nice website.

   

Onyx November 7, 2008 at 3:26 am

The glossy screen’s usefulness is very situational. For a coder and writer like me who likes to use dark backgrounds in my documents (e.g. writeroom) the super glossy is pretty useless to me because the screen reflects light very badly if you use a black background. Also I’m one of those people stay glued to the computer for more then ten hours a day so matte is easier on the eyes for me. I’ve used a glossy iMac before and I felt my eyes water from eyestrain in just 3 hours of work.

I’m pretty sure, for the guy who just like to view photos and watch videos the glossy screen is awesome though.

   

DeeBee November 11, 2008 at 3:42 am

I’ve purchased a new topline Mac laptop for my office every fall or winter since 2003 and couldn’t wait to get the new “brickbook”, since, being in manufacturing, I’ve lusted after it from the moment I saw the new design. The rigidity of the chassis and the buttery keyboard are all I’d hoped for (though the black keyboard is, to me, a step backwards aesthetically). But alas, I am returning it, for 1 reason only: the glossy screen.

The problem is I make my living working at this machine, spending my days primarily in email, photoshop, illustrator, excel, and some web browsing. The glare is a real issue and a source of fatigue - for the folks here that are saying of the glare “you get used to it and you learn to see past it” we are all indeed capable of that, but your eyes and brain are doing more work to filter out that fluorescent light or that window behind you or whatever it is that is bouncing back at you. -For me, after far less than my usual 10-12 hours a day in front of this machine, I’m aware of it and tired of it.

I think the move to all glossy is a slick, but potentially risky move on the part of apple to re-package a technology that is great only for some (consumers first & foremost), as something fabulous for all. This is a macbook “Pro” and a lot of “Pros” need to get work done in office environments with variable lighting issues. I have a gorgeous view from my office window, which is behind me, and now I would need to close the blind all day to block it out. - I pay way too much for this location to do that

A photographer we hire regularly has the same issue, as he shoots digitally on all types of locations, and is also sticking with his 2-year old MBP for now as well.

What’s funny is that when CRT monitors became available with good non-glare surfaces it was a huge move forward, and you couldn’t give away a glossy CRT after that. There is a reason Non-glare screens were developed.

There are 3 things that kinda stink about this move to all Glossy:

1. I’ve got to stick with my creaky 1 yr old MBP and pray that Apple sees fit to offer matte again in their pro line soon. I’m upgrading memory and hard drive in the interim, but that’s not money spent with Apple.

2. Mac militants (many of whom presumably purchase a fraction of what we do each year in Apple products) in the online community are absurdly hostile towards those who don’t like Glossy. What is the matter with these people? (listen to yourselves, culty-types, you sound like hard-line fascists (or fox news) when you criticize as whiners, anyone who doesn’t see things the way you do).

3. As an Apple shareholder, I find the arrogance of this move (though I believe it is purely a cost savings/practicality move on Apples part, not some nastier conspiracy), troubling. How many other pros won’t buy because of this?

(-on that note I’ve decided to keep my 23” cinema display instead of upgrading to the slick new one with speakers and a Magsafe output (how nice would that be?) for the same Glossy reason..)

Sorry for the rant, but this is my first time venting about this.

   

Milind Alvares November 12, 2008 at 4:44 am goobimama.blogspot.com

Thank you so much for that rant, if you want to call it that. I realise now that our research wasn’t as extensive as it should have been. I guess the pro users don’t necessarily hang out on forums and twitter.

   

DeeBee November 12, 2008 at 4:56 am

No problem.
Until there are new developments on this front, any idea where we can purchase these?

http://photoput.com/images/f9p8a2rnp65l7sga12y.jpg

   

Bill Wisser November 13, 2008 at 12:02 pm billwisserphoto.com

I’m glad you realize that your initial premise of surveying those who bought the glossy- screened machines would inevitably skew your results — because it would leave out Mac users such as myself who, having looked at the way too reflective screens, bought a high-end, early 2008 MacBook Pro with a matte screen instead, and at a very nice discount.

Of course, I would have preferred the newer model — except for the glossy screen which was a deal-breaker for me.

I’m a professional photographer and find the reflections on the glossy screens and their surrounding black bezels highly distracting. What’s more, the super-saturated and very contrasty look of the glossy screens seems inaccurate for effective image adjustments.

I e-mailed Steve Jobs asking him to bring back the matte option on both the MacBook Pros and the 13-inch MacBooks. Charge $50 extra for it, if you must, but please give professionals that option.

Also, at least one Firewire 400 port on the MacBook is essential for what I do, and if the new 13-inch MacBook had that and a matte screen, it would be a perect back-up laptop on location.

And although I know that I could daisy chain firewire devices connected to the single Firewire 800 port on the new MBPs, I prefer the convenience of having a couple of extra Firewire 400 ports as well, like on the previous generation machines, such as the one I just bought.

Jobs recently responded to the passionate feedback of upset iPhone app developers by modifying the SDK rules as they asked, and I’m hopeful that Jobs and company will similarly respond to the photographers and videographers and give us back the beautiful matte screens!

BTW, thanks for your website.

   

Ryan November 15, 2008 at 6:43 pm

I just compared my old trusty eMac’s glass screen with my new Macbook’s glass screen. One thing I noticed with my eMac is that it barely reflects anything at all, while the Macbook was way more reflective. This means the eMac’s glass screen was treated with some sort of anti-reflective coating while my poor Macbook was not.

   

Sean November 15, 2008 at 11:30 pm

I purchased a new 13 inch MacBook twice, and returned them both times because I could not adapt to the sub-par colors and viewing angle of the new glass-covered screen. I work intensively with color, and the offered colors are extremely disappointing on the new MacBook to say the very least. The eye strain caused by the display is outrageous, in every type of lighting, including darkness. It lacks the crispness needed to work in graphics applications such as Adobe Illustrator. The new MacBook Pros do not seem to improve enough on this to make a purchase productive. I am considering purchasing a previous-generation MacBook Pro from Best Buy or Amazon with the discounted price. After testing one, I found that the display makes images jump from the screen. You could reach in and pull out any of the dock icons and slip them into your pocket. It’s too bad that Apple seems to be losing sight of it’s expertise in making artist tools and favoring average-user entertainment-only quality flashy electronic devices instead.

   

Milind Alvares November 15, 2008 at 11:45 pm goobimama.blogspot.com

The MacBook is definitely not a pro machine. The colour reproduction has always been poor and anyone working with colour needs to consider a MacBook Pro. Too bad there’s no 13” MacBook Pro for those who want a smaller machine. That said, the glossy displays are creating widespread discontent among the professionals and Apple seriously needs to reconsider their strategy.

   

smirker November 17, 2008 at 10:56 pm

If any of you can find me a professional level LCD monitor with a glossy display I’ll eat my laptop.

Pro monitors are matte for a reason. Give us the choice Apple.

   

Janus November 18, 2008 at 1:18 am

You guys need to get a life, seriously. It’s a glossy display. Get over it. And go ahead, buy a Vista box. I dare you.

   

Angelo November 24, 2008 at 4:47 pm none

What would you recommend then in the mean time?? An HP HDX 16???

I have my name down to get a new 15” MBP this week wednesday, but by the sounds of it, id be making a huge mistake?

Im a photographer and this would have been my first MBP???

Please HELP?!?!?

   

Bill Wisser November 24, 2008 at 7:18 pm billwisserphoto.com

Angelo -

There have also been a lot of bugs reported in the present first generation of this new MBP design - such as loose hinges allowing the screen to drop closed unexpectedly. and track pad misbehavior when clicking.

Bugs are not totally unexpected on first-gen equipment — but they are perhaps another reason for you to consider buying an excellent, previous generation MBP at a healthy discount — they are still widely available at great prices.

Also, in fairness, if there’s an Apple store near you, check out one of the new glossy screens in person — some people don’t mind them, though most photographers (myself included) find them hard to work on. But see for yourself.

   

Michael November 25, 2008 at 1:43 am

I’m using the adobe suite for design and trying to switch to mac, but because the matte isn’t availalbe on the newer macbook pros i’m wondering what the best move would be…

Should i wait until mac releases something with matte? It sounds like Steve Jobs doesn’t really care about people getting eye strain - I had an injury to my eye many years ago and it physically hurts to look at anything except matte, not to mention all of the other issues listed above. Should I get the refreshed 17 inch macbook pro - It seems like the 17 inch is overpriced considering it doesn’t have the latest technology. Finally should i just buy a cheaper 15 or 17 inch previous gen macbook pro… This is so frustrating!!!

   

Milind Alvares November 25, 2008 at 1:50 am goobimama.blogspot.com

@Michael: I think you should go in for the much cheaper 15” previous generation models (available on Amazon and several other places). Solid stable machines and will last you for a long time to come.

I don’t think Apple is going to offer a matte option just yet. Although, we still have until Macworld to see whether they have something like that in the works.

   

bxt November 25, 2008 at 2:16 am

Michael, I think you should go for the previous generation MacBook Pro. If you don’t care too much about these new fancy looks then I think you will be just right on the previous gen MBP. And since you’re coming from the PC world, the MBP is a sexy upgrade anyway!

Let us know how it goes.

   

Michael November 25, 2008 at 4:49 am

Thanks for the advice! I ordered from PC connection the previous generation MacBook Pro Intel Core 2 Duo 17” 2.5Ghz 2GB RAM 250GB SuperDrive Matte Screen for $2,249.95. I’ll upgrade to the 4gb of ram. Hopefully this will be powerful enough to do video editing/flash/photoshop etc.

Thanks everyone!

-Mike

   

Milind Alvares November 25, 2008 at 6:07 am goobimama.blogspot.com

Congrats on your purchase! And hit us up with any questions you might have with dealing with Mac OS X.

   

DeeBee November 25, 2008 at 10:33 am

Mike,

+1 on all fronts.

Following up on my original post, I returned the new all-aluminum MBP to Apple and ordered a new (pre-october) Matte 15” 2.5Ghz MBP from PC Connection. -Was a good deal with rebate, and we have a home for the 1 year old MBP as well, though it looks like the resale value on those is still holding up well on CL.

I miss the feel of the new-style keyboard, and to a lesser extent, the glass trackpad, but neither are missed to the degree that I feel fortunate to have a Matte screen at this point!

Whew!

Cheers

   

s woodside December 2, 2008 at 2:47 am simonwoodside.com

So perhaps you can add an update to your actual post now that you realize your methodology aint so good, huh? As an owner of the last version of the previous MBP — in matte — I am VERY relieved that I bought then and not now. I work primarily in sunny rooms, I’ve used glossy laptops in the past, and they drive me nuts with the eyestrain and the not being able to see the screen. I recently bought an expensive LCD TV — again in matte — for precisely the same reason (my TV room is sunny). Being able to see the screen in a sunlit room is very important to me, and so is having good colour representation.

   

Michael December 2, 2008 at 5:37 am

Does anyone recommend a good 24”/26” Monitor for Graphic Design? I see the mac advertising NEC monitors which are fairly expensive, specifically the multisync 90 series… Does apple make anything worth purchasing?

I’m also looking into the adobe packages for software which are farily expensive. I’m not sure why the production package doesn’t include Dreamweaver…I guess they want to upsell their master suite - The master suite is currently 2400 dollars.

   

Boiling Point December 2, 2008 at 7:11 am

I’ve recently been speaking to friends of mine who are designers and photographers as well. Pretty much none of them are buying anything gloss. Being a core base of their business, the consensus is it feels like Apple have basically flipped creatives the bird. Going all gloss is a decision that’s really created some hostility.

I’m sure Apple will still sell a bunch MacBook Pros and LED monitors. After all, everyone has different prefs and needs. But it seems alot of people are also looking at previous generation models as well as alternatives when really it wouldn’t need to be that way.

While this is only one snapshot, this particular thread has become an interesting discussion. I think you guys should forward it to Steve

@Michael: Depending on how deep your pockets are, Apples current 23” LCD Cinema display is nice - I use one, and we have 3 in the studio. Or else I hear Dells 24” Ultra Sharp Widescreen Flat Panel Monitor is not only great value, but when properly calibrated provides an excellent picture.

   

Milind Alvares December 2, 2008 at 6:39 pm goobimama.blogspot.com

@Woodside: Updated the post a bit.

@Boiling Point: Sure thing. That’s a good idea.

   

flamejob December 2, 2008 at 10:55 pm

What a storm in a teacup.

I bought a Unibody MacBook Pro the day after they came out and it is fantastic. I am a working professional (architecture) who uses his computer for a lot more than 6 hours a day and find it fine.

Yeah I do live in dull UK, but even in the brightest settings it’s fine.

I suppose all you moaners can stick on a matt thing if that floats your boat??

   

Michael December 3, 2008 at 4:48 am

@Boiling Point: Thanks for pointing me in the right direction via monitors. I just purchased one of the Lacie 1TB hard drive’s to take advantage of the firewire 800 port. Do you recommend Time Capsule?

@flamejob: I’m guessing you didn’t sign this?? http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?38djhak2.

   

flamejob December 3, 2008 at 5:06 am

Nope!

   

Michael December 3, 2008 at 5:42 am

I just spoke to one of our flash designers who said that they recommend the airport extreme over time capsule since the backing up process tends to slow down the network.

   

s woodside December 3, 2008 at 10:11 am simonwoodside.com

@Milind: Thanks I realize for most people this may not be a big deal, but for some (possibly a minority, but arguably an important customer section for apple) it’s “glaringly” obvious that matte needs to be an option, at least on the MPB and the professional displays. I expect having that option adds cost for Apple, but at that level (and HIGH price point) I expect to be able to get what I need from apple for my $$$.

   

Mr_Wagstaff December 13, 2008 at 9:58 pm

Glossy versus matt is not the only issue…I was in the Apple store yesterday and side by side were the new glossy 15” Macbook pro and the current (old style)17” Macbook Pro also with a glossy screen. I dislike glossy but looking at the 17” glossy screen I concluded it would be tolerable. However the NEW GLOSSY screen was a different beast..no matter how I tilted and angled the machine and screen there were crystal clear reflections of myself, the lights, the whole store. The OLD GLOSSY screen also has reflections but they are almost invisible compared to the NEW GLOSSY. Conclusion…do not look at your existing glossy screen and expect the same from the new machine. The new machine functions as a far superior mirror.

One other point: Psychology is important here…just because there are many people who can live comfortably with purple wallpaper does not mean that purple wallpaper is OK for all people. Despite trying very hard not to be, I am very disracted by reflections in almost every glossy screen Ive ever used. It was a great thing to buy my first LCD TV that didnt have the kitchen lights superimposed over the movie!

For myself and obviously a significant proportion of other Apple users, glossy is a backwards step. Even guys who worked at the Apple store agreed as they admitted(has to be coaxed out of them)many people have stalled on purchasing the new kit upon seeing them shine in the store.

By removing such a critical option, Apple have instantly alienated themselves from thousands of loyal customers and feelings are running strong. No matter how much someone who loves glossy says “glossy is good get over it etc”, they will not change the feelings of someone who cannot tolerate it.

Apple have no obligation to make anything at all. But given the position they are in and the reliance of so many on their products as an alternative to Microsoft systems, I hope they announce a matte option sooner rather than later and end the frustration of a sizable proportion of their customer base myself included. I do not want to feel towards Apple as I do towards AOL. but thats another story!!

   

Michael December 23, 2008 at 12:14 am

Status report: my mbp 17” early 2008 model arrived a few days ago - I found some 4c latency memory “apparently this is 28% faster then apple stock memory which is 5c” online to upgrade it to 4g ram and it’s extremely fast! The screen/os/keyboard/trackpad makes it fun to use. I purchased Apple Logic software to record music and an Apogee Duet from the mac store which is a midi with 2 studio quality pre-amps and uses firewire 400 - another reason i’m glad I didn’t go with the new version MBP since my firewire 800 is connected to a g-tech teradrive. It really sounds incredible and feels like I finally have a home recording studio solution. I just feel really lucky to have gotten this specific model…my CS4 adobe masters collection is on the way. Thanks for the recommendations and have a happy holiday.

   

Milind Alvares December 23, 2008 at 10:20 am goobimama.blogspot.com

Congrats on your purchase Michael, and I’m sure you’ll enjoy your holidays with your awesome new MacBook Pro

   

Sean February 6, 2009 at 9:19 pm

Finally Apple has released a matte pro! I was both shocked and pleased to see that the newly redesigned 17” MBP not only displays the best color of any Apple notebook ever, but it is available in a matte display option for an extra $50. That is great! coming up with $3,000.00 is another story. It’d be nice if they upgraded the 15” color again and added an available matte option for that model as well.

   

judy July 3, 2009 at 9:41 am

Read this site and links, polls etc., more people prefer matte than glossy.

Of course, we want everyone to be happy, so choice for all!

http://macmatte.wordpress.com/